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Another one bites the dust.


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#1 GeorgeH

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Posted 04 January 2013 - 02:08 AM

It seems extradition to the US is an emotional topic for some in the UK. Well another one was extradited this week. Abid Nasseer, from Pakistan, studying in Manchester was sent to the US to stand trial. So what do you think? Should he have stayed in the UK to stand trial, or was it ok for him to be sent across the pond?

#2 intheblitz

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Posted 04 January 2013 - 08:46 AM

We could probably fill a dozen 747's with people who hate our Country but still choose to live here because we let them and they get swallowed by the "we help anyone except our own" culture. You can have the lot of them.  :mad:



#3 meditate

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Posted 04 January 2013 - 08:48 AM

He is a Pakistani National so its more of an issue for Pakistan. In the UK there was not enough evidence to secure a prosecution so it will be interesting to se if the US has stronger evidence or a lower threshold.


Edited by meditate, 04 January 2013 - 08:50 AM.


#4 scousejon

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Posted 04 January 2013 - 12:09 PM

We have an extradition agreement with the US.  I have no issue sending them over there.  I believe in their justice system.



#5 GeorgeH

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Posted 04 January 2013 - 07:15 PM

He is a Pakistani National so its more of an issue for Pakistan. In the UK there was not enough evidence to secure a prosecution so it will be interesting to se if the US has stronger evidence or a lower threshold.

 

He claims that he would be tortured in Pakistan. Your government claims that he was planning to set off bombs in Manchester. The US found out ab out him due to an investigation and arrest of a co-conspirator.



#6 meditate

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Posted 04 January 2013 - 08:48 PM

My main point is that regardless what the Govt may be saying is the fact that in the UK there was no realistic prospect of him being convicted. The US have applied for extradition on the grounds that he was also involved in a wider plot involving Norway and New York but interestingly the US still mention the UK I believe in their extradition request even though the UK have stated that the evidence is not strong enough to go forward to prosecution - in our country anyway.


Edited by meditate, 04 January 2013 - 08:50 PM.


#7 GeorgeH

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Posted 05 January 2013 - 05:05 PM

Hi meditate:

I am just trying to understand your position. We have debated this topic on at least three different threads. In one thread, we has similar facts:, but in all three cases you were against shipping the criminal to the US. The difference here is that the criminal is not a UK citizen. I just want to know why a US Prison is ok for him.

#8 meditate

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Posted 05 January 2013 - 09:46 PM

Hi George, you may be missing my main points then. With regards to the gentleman in this thread being a Pakistani National it would be up to the Pakistani authorities to kick up any fuss if they so wished. The point I was making with regards to extradition in this particular case is that the extradition warrant mentions (I am led to believe) potential terrorist activity in the UK. Given that the UK do not have strong enough evidence to secure a prosecution it led me to wonder why the US believe that they do when we do not. I am also aware that New York and another country are on the warrant. Interestingly a High Court Judge MI5 and the police consider him a danger to National Security - Considering the Crown Prosecution Service (CPS) state there is not enough evidence to secure a conviction then I am a little surprised that this view would be stated publicly.

 

What I am definitely against and which we have debated at length is the US exerting global powers trying to secure prosecutions for people who have not been to the US and where the crimes were not committed and, which is compounded when the host country are not bringing a prosecution themselves as it does not break their laws. My final main point is that the extradition treaty is not fair between the UK and the US and that when extradited there are profound implications ranging from legal costs to the differences in how the two legal systems work with the US having a very heavy emphasis on plea bargaining which effectively means that the vast majority will accept a guilty plea because the risk of gong to trial is between serving a few months with a plea bargain vs many years if going to trial - though I know we have different perspectives on this one also.



#9 GeorgeH

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 01:31 AM

Given that the UK do not have strong enough evidence to secure a prosecution it led me to wonder why the US believe that they do when we do not. I am also aware that New York and another country are on the warrant. Interestingly a High Court Judge MI5 and the police consider him a danger to National Security - Considering the Crown Prosecution Service (CPS) state there is not enough evidence to secure a conviction then I am a little surprised that this view would be stated publicly.

 

Plea barganing. The way the US system works, a criminal can reduce his sentence by giving evidence against people higher up on the food chain. Also the US has a very active intelligence group of agencies.






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