Jump to content

  •  

Photo
- - - - -

One in three serious offenders has 15 or more convictions of cautions


  • This topic is locked This topic is locked
38 replies to this topic

#26 OFFLINE   stewie_griffin

stewie_griffin

    UKPOLICEONLINE Regular

  • Senior Resident Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 926 posts

Posted 24 February 2013 - 11:33 PM

...plenty of crime is committed IN prison, but somehow it's against "bad people" so that really doesn't count.

 

Couldn't have put it better myself.



#27 OFFLINE   SimonT

SimonT

    -

  • Account Closed
  • 7,290 posts
  • Interests:police, climbing

Posted 25 February 2013 - 09:45 AM

".plenty of crime is committed IN prison, but somehow it's against "bad people" so that really doesn't count."- I dont really mind this all that much. Its almost as if prison is not the nicest place to be. There is also the possibility that its part of rehab, letting the criminals know what its like to be victims of crime. 

 

At the moment the only guaranteed way to prevent prolific offenders committing crime is to put them in prison. If someone can come up with another way then thats fine, but no one has.



#28 ONLINE   Sub-seven

Sub-seven

    UKPOLICEONLINE Icon

  • Senior Resident Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,962 posts

Posted 25 February 2013 - 09:59 AM

Lethal injection?



#29 OFFLINE   morek54

morek54

    UKPOLICEONLINE Regular

  • Senior Resident Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 1,086 posts

Posted 25 February 2013 - 10:04 AM

I always love the comment "whilst in prison, they're not out committing crime". True as that may be, plenty of crime is committed IN prison, but somehow it's against "bad people" so that really doesn't count. However these "bad people" are normally released one day and join the good side again. Locking people up if just geography. Proper rehabilitation actually stops the crime occuring in the first place.

What is proper rehabilitation?  Does it exist at present?  If the re offending rates are anything to go by, it either doesn't exist or it doesn't work.  Therefore, where is the basis in fact for saying that "proper rehabilitation" works.  There seems to be little to make that judgement against.  But what is clear is that it doesn't stop crime in the first place as rehabilitation, or attempts at, will normally follow crimes having already occurred.  Naturally.

 

I appreciate there is a discussion to be had in respect of the criminal justice system and what does or doesn't work.  Or what might or might not work.  But we shouldn't also loose sight of the fact that the criminal justice system is first and foremost about holding those who break the law to account and duly punishing them for the crimes they have committed.  And when all is said and done, there surely has to be a degree of effectiveness at that point which seems lacking.  Rehabilitation, as I say elsewhere, is more as I see it a lame attempt to shut the barn door after the horse has bolted.  The point I make is that many offenders, by the time the go to prison, are hardened and entrenched in their ways and life style.  To think that can be easily turned around is fanciful idealism.  In my opinion.  It's not as simplistic as that.  There has to be a willingness to change or reform on the individual - and many of these people grow into and exists within a sub-culture, which they will always be a part of primarily because their outside life revolves around and is influenced by that particular life-style.  A life-style, I might add, that few on the outside who never encroach daily into their lives can ever really understand or appreciate. 

 

Of course, there will always be those who have simply gone through a bad time, rebelled in their youth for example, and grow out of their offending.  Meet a girl, settle down and have kids.  Grow up for want of a better word.  There might also be those, who continue offending to some degree or another but manage to avoid being caught again.  On the face of it, someone might claim credit for rehabilitating such individuals - but rehabilitation really does depend on the individual.  Others can only do so much - and what they cannot do is alter external influences once the offender returns to his/her life on the outside. Of course, we also have to acknowledge some people are just plain bad.  They always will be.  For others, crime pays.  Prison is but an inconvenience.  But it's how they earn their bread on the outside.  At the higher end of the scale, some enjoy far better life-styles than many of us here.  These are life choices, let's be realistic, which will never be easily relinquished.  Let's not kid ourselves.

 

I just think there is undue focus on the term rehabilitation and that the assumption that it is somehow the solution to the problems is severely misguided.   Especially when there appears to be no due consideration paid to what it actually looks like and what can realistically be achieved. 

 

Rehabilitation, as far as government ministers are concerned more to the point, means deflecting the blame elsewhere.  That is, pointing the finger of blame towards those working within the system who have presumably failed in making those who come through the system into better humans, when in reality they (and successive governments) have repeatedly neglected to address the real issues.  Smoke and mirrors, if you like.  As ever.



#30 ONLINE   Sub-seven

Sub-seven

    UKPOLICEONLINE Icon

  • Senior Resident Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,962 posts

Posted 25 February 2013 - 01:39 PM

What is proper rehabilitation?  Does it exist at present?  If the re offending rates are anything to go by, it either doesn't exist or it doesn't work.  Therefore, where is the basis in fact for saying that "proper rehabilitation" works.  There seems to be little to make that judgement against.  But what is clear is that it doesn't stop crime in the first place as rehabilitation, or attempts at, will normally follow crimes having already occurred.  Naturally.

I have 17 years service and find that the same names crop all the time whether it be druggies, house breakers, drug dealers or breach merchants and now I find that the sons (and daughters) have followed the same career path and feature on the bulletins as well now - cosy.



#31 OFFLINE   stewie_griffin

stewie_griffin

    UKPOLICEONLINE Regular

  • Senior Resident Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 926 posts

Posted 25 February 2013 - 03:11 PM

I have 17 years service and find that the same names crop all the time whether it be druggies, house breakers, drug dealers or breach merchants and now I find that the sons (and daughters) have followed the same career path and feature on the bulletins as well now - cosy.

 

I can go one better than that...

 

I've been out of the UK for five years now but I still keep in touch by reading the online version of my old local newspaper. The other day, the police ran a big operation and arrested and charged a load of small-time drug dealers. Would you believe it,as I went through the list I remember arresting every single one of them!



#32 OFFLINE   meditate

meditate

    UKPOLICEONLINE Guru

  • Senior Resident Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,903 posts

Posted 25 February 2013 - 04:16 PM

Not wishing to appear soft (!) but I do wonder what options are open to people when they get a criminal record. For me depending on the charge it could easily mean the loss of my job and, with a criminal conviction in this economic environment it must make it several times harder to secure employment - I guess the only options open are self employment, a relative who owns his own business or continue a life of crime. My main point being that it feels like a quite a serious big hole to get yourself out of (yes I know they made their bed etc).



#33 OFFLINE   DoubleG

DoubleG

    UKPOLICEONLINE Full Member

  • Resident Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 269 posts
  • Interests:Baddies

Posted 26 February 2013 - 02:05 AM

What about prison being somewhere where no-one would ever want to return, therefore proving to be a deterrent to crime?

#34 ONLINE   Sub-seven

Sub-seven

    UKPOLICEONLINE Icon

  • Senior Resident Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,962 posts

Posted 26 February 2013 - 08:17 AM

Dream on...



#35 OFFLINE   SimonT

SimonT

    -

  • Account Closed
  • 7,290 posts
  • Interests:police, climbing

Posted 26 February 2013 - 08:53 AM

Alwasy said we should have one prison, where there is no rehab, no fully stuff, no tv, radio, books, anything. Just a cot bed and hard labour every day. Then we could at least try 'you have one more chance and then its off to hell island!' (dun dun dun!) 



#36 OFFLINE   meditate

meditate

    UKPOLICEONLINE Guru

  • Senior Resident Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,903 posts

Posted 26 February 2013 - 09:04 AM

Alwasy said we should have one prison, where there is no rehab, no fully stuff, no tv, radio, books, anything. Just a cot bed and hard labour every day. Then we could at least try 'you have one more chance and then its off to hell island!' (dun dun dun!) 

 

Would that be the Isle of Wight?

 

 

Or the Isle of Wong


Edited by meditate, 26 February 2013 - 09:05 AM.


#37 OFFLINE   SimonT

SimonT

    -

  • Account Closed
  • 7,290 posts
  • Interests:police, climbing

Posted 26 February 2013 - 09:07 AM

I wouldnt have a problem with an island like that. A bit like escape from New york, just chuck them on and leave them to it. 



#38 OFFLINE   DoubleG

DoubleG

    UKPOLICEONLINE Full Member

  • Resident Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 269 posts
  • Interests:Baddies

Posted 26 February 2013 - 11:45 AM

Alwasy said we should have one prison, where there is no rehab, no fully stuff, no tv, radio, books, anything. Just a cot bed and hard labour every day. Then we could at least try 'you have one more chance and then its off to hell island!' (dun dun dun!) 


....rings Ant and Dec

#39 OFFLINE   dolly1966

dolly1966

    UKPOLICEONLINE Regular

  • Senior Resident Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 602 posts
  • Interests:I enjoy walking my dogs, meeting up with friends, travelling and dining out.

Posted 26 February 2013 - 11:56 AM

"I am serving a Custodial Sentence GET ME OUT OF HERE"   :tongue:






0 user(s) are browsing this forum

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users